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ready in here and see what happens when

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we stimulate this one acupuncture point

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this is not to scale but the time is to

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scale so what happens is that I'm going

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to stimulate this acupuncture point

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here's what the accurate points are

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points acupuncture points look like

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along the Meridian you can see there are

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different sizes and I'm going to

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stimulate this particular acupuncture

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point down here and let's see what

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okay we've stimulated that acupuncture

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point and now the information at that

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stimulation is moving on Meridian and

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now stimulates this acupuncture point

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the information continues to move along

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the Meridian smoothing actually about

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five to ten centimeters per second it's

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a very slow moving signal along the

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Meridian continues on this points a

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little further along and now this

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acupuncture point is even further away

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along the same Meridian takes it a

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little bit longer to get there that the

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time here is correct though and

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so we've produced a real-time images of

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acupuncture points during simulation

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although the data is collected during

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heal time reduce the images that you see

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later when stimulated the acupuncture

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twists itself around the needle the

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simulation process is communicated to

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other acupoints along the same Meridian

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it speeds depends upon the individual

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but it goes from five to ten centimeters

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per second it turns out that a number of

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the subjects that we've used are very

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very sensitive to this process or the

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flow of Chi and their description of the

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flow of Chi up their leg of energy is

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precisely what we measure and the right

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that we measure obviously

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well maybe not obviously but the

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mechanisms or the nature of the

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communication process is certainly

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unknown and something we are trying to

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investigate at this point in time now

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we're using fMRI to produce signals from

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acupuncture stimulation and as I

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indicated earlier the classical fMRI

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study is to

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the time between flashing lights and

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brain activity which takes about a

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hundred and eighty two hundred

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milliseconds but we actually let's use

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ultrasound actually stimulate the

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acupuncture point because it allows us

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to make precise measurements of time

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between stimulation and brain activity

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it turns out that when you do this and

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you begin looking at what happens in the

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visual cortex of the brain you see a

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signal that appears to be there almost

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instantaneously less than or equal to

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about eight tenths of a millisecond this

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is actually two orders of magnitude

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faster than any known process which

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actually drives my neuroscience

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colleagues absolutely nuts but if you

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turns out if you stimulate an

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acupuncture point you stimulate a region

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that's not an acupuncture point you

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don't see this when you stimulate the

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acupuncture point you see it simulate a

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non acupuncture point you don't see it

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seem to let the acupuncture point you do

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so you tell me what's the problem and

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hopefully someone can also explain

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what's going on it's certainly

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consistent with subtle energy fields or

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perhaps the acupuncture point is

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generating a pulse of electromagnetic

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energy that's picked up an acupuncture

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one in the brain the the process is is

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still very very much under studying an

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investigation

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well we've sort of delineated three

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different pathways by which the signals

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of stimulation actually get to the brain

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there's this very very fast signal could

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be instantaneous there is activity that

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you see in the visual cortex about a

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hundred and eighty 200 milliseconds

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later this is clearly along a nerve

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pathway and then there's this very slow

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signal that moves along the meridians

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taking many seconds to get to the to the

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brain center so what you see in AFM our

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image is an initial pulse of activity

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then additional activity at this time

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frame and in much later additional

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activities our studies of acupuncture is

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still in a very early stage there are

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many challenging and fundamental

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problems remain to be solved however I

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really do think that the results could

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potentially fundamentally change not

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only the practice of medicine delivery

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of healthcare system but we may also

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shake up the standard scientific

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paradigm just

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but thank you very much how exciting I

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promise this lady from the last session

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hi I'm Baris Sims and this is a question

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leftover from your last session I'm

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really interested in your use of

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cleaning the laboratories and the

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healing and the housecleaning with

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colors and would like to know more about

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that

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are there specific reasons why certain

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colors might be selected and what with

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their effects being is there a certain

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color that's shown in a dirty lab versus

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a clean lab well there are there are a

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number there are a number of books about

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you know I'm I have amateur status as a

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pranic healer so are are as a healer in

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general but there are a number of books

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available on on on healing and in pranic

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healing in particular in fact there's a

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marvelous book called your hands can

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heal you that's written by Stephen Coe

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that's I think it's quite a wonderful

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book and it turns out we have a superb

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rumba chronic healer with us today that

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I didn't know was gonna be here Mary

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Clark and you why don't you you can chat

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with her later because she knows about

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everything about pranic healing if one

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should ever know how did I set you up

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okay and she lives in San Diego I'll put

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in a plug for you she's in she's in San

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Diego and she she actually does pranic

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healing in her practice and is quite

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active in the pranic healing community

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and is also a very nice person

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so Joey Karl med would if I have a

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question regarding the stimulation of

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acupuncture point where you the one's

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further down the Meridian adopted the

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same shape did they seem to be aligned

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on a like a north-south axis is is that

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the alignment type of thing you know no

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no there's barely that metaphorically

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the north-south but I mean in a way that

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one could describe his north-south it

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was no the the acupuncture points the

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top of the acupuncture points were

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facing the skin so if you come up a leg

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they're all sort of facing in the same

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direction up the leg okay hi no no I I

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don't know that's the way that's the way

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they are I you know what makes them that

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way I'm not sure Mike Wilson how long

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does the acupuncture stay stimulated

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after it's been stimulated I wish I had

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a good answer for you that it depends on

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the level of stimulation you do if you

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continually stimulate the acupuncture

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points they seem to be stimulated for a

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longer period of time but quite honestly

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that's not something that we've really

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looked at carefully we have some sort of

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anecdotal data on that but I really

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wouldn't be able to answer the question

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very carefully I'm Darryl ahem

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absolutely amazing work these last three

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talks have just blown me away the

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question I have is what this tells us

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about replicability in other labs

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especially hostile labs toward the SCI

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condition but I know it's better that

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you're that you're of publishing in sort

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of preaching to the choir publications

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and we want to change the standard

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scientific paradigm I'm wondering with

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the quality of these studies that I've

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observed where have you tried to publish

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and what were their reasons for not

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publishing well that's an interesting

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story let me let me talk to you let me

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let me mention let's forget about pranic

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healing that's just too weird but let's

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talk about the acupuncture study okay

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when we did this acupuncture study the

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initial one back in 96 97 with the

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images it was the first study that had

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ever been done where that showed a

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direct relationship between the

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stimulation of an acupuncture point in

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activity in the in the brain and I had

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already pre-selected the images that I

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knew were going to be in the first cup

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on the front cover of science and you

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know and so we wrote this paper for

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science we submitted it we didn't get a

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response

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and finally after a while we called the

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the editor in Washington and one of the

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one of the staff members basically said

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oh you submitted that paper we don't

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review that sort of stuff so we could

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even get a review all right now the

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story goes on

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we then submitted the manuscript to

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nature and now there are three editors

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of nature there's one in London there's

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one in Washington there's one in Tokyo

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so we thought well we might have a

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better response if we submitted this to

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Tokyo we did and the editor in Tokyo did

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actually read the paper and thought it

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was interesting but was extremely

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uncomfortable publishing this he decided

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that he would consider it if we could

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get a of outside reviewers of our choice

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that would write letters about it we had

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five Nobel Prize winners in the

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neurosciences that wrote five raved

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letters about the manuscript and he

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still decided that it he just couldn't

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publish this in nature all five of the

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members the Nobel Prize winners were